official chart Billboard Charts (January 29 - February 4, 2017)

[Rentboy]

On 02/02/2017 at 4:40 AM, shelven said:

I mean the purity point is a matter of opinion, but how are sales a "more honest" measure of popularity than streams? Sales only tell you when someone initially buys a song, and gives you absolutely no indication as to how often they're listening to it or when they get bored of it and stop listening altogether. Streaming tells you exactly when and how many people are actively listening to a song. How is that not a more accurate way of determining what songs are more popular in the current moment?

Ok Im baffled why you think ONE persons love of something is relevant to the charts? Charts are supposed to represent how popular things are amonst the general public at large not how popular they are with individuals. It shouldnt even matter how many times one person plays a song. And we all know there are fans who will stream insane amounts just to boost its chart position. Which just corrupts the charts.

Edited February 4, 2017 by Rentboy
add line

[shelven]

13 minutes ago, Rentboy said:

Ok Im baffled why you think ONE persons love of something is relevant to the charts? Charts are supposed to represent how popular things are amonst the general public at large not how popular they are with individuals. It shouldnt even matter how many times one person plays a song.

I don't think one person's love of something is relevant to the charts - I think that the relevancy of the charts should be consistent with the relevancy of the various music consumption platforms, and whether or not you like the fact that streaming is now more widely used than sales, it still remains a fact. I actually find it extremely ironic how you're using the "general public" argument, when the reality is that the general public is now listening to music through streaming, while only dedicated fans are purchasing music anymore.

 

And of course it matters how many times a person plays a song because that speaks to the longevity of the song  If 1,000,000 people listen to a song in its first week and also its tenth week, while a different song has 1,000,000 people listening to it in its first week but only 100,000 listening to it in its tenth week, why should those two songs be considered equal in terms of popularity in the tenth week? The first song is clearly more popular than the second song in their respective tenth weeks. If the chart was sales-only, then you'd only be judging popularity in terms of how many NEW people discover the song and completely ignoring people who have already discovered the song but are still listening to it. Before streaming, that was the best we could do, but now that we have a way of measuring people who are discovering the song AND people who are still playing a song, that's obviously the far more accurate way of assessing the popularity of a song, and in all honesty I'm confused how anyone could not understand that.

Edited February 4, 2017 by shelven

[novembers17th]

45 minutes ago, Rentboy said:

I don't see how one person streaming a song multiple times should be counted in compiling the charts data AT ALL. That just means ONE person really likes the song. When you purchase a song or album it counts just once so why should one persons individual streams count multiple times? This is what Im saying about how sales are the purest & most honest measure of popularity. Sure people can buy it numerous times but thats gonna cost them. Streaming over & over doesnt.

They take that into account, that's why it takes way more streams to count for points than sales. Also, streaming might not cost money, but it does cost time, and that's certainly worth something imo

[Adonis]

17 hours ago, Rentboy said:

I don't see how one person streaming a song multiple times should be counted in compiling the charts data AT ALL. That just means ONE person really likes the song. When you purchase a song or album it counts just once so why should one persons individual streams count multiple times? This is what Im saying about how sales are the purest & most honest measure of popularity. Sure people can buy it numerous times but thats gonna cost them. Streaming over & over doesnt.

Billboard measures popularity. Sales is just one indicator. How popular can a song be if someone buys a record but doesn't listen to the record. Streaming is a more accurate indicator of what is popular. The assumption is that a user won't listen to a record they don't like. That's likely to be true especially in the case of streaming.

Edited February 4, 2017 by Adonis

[Adonis]

16 hours ago, shelven said:

I don't think one person's love of something is relevant to the charts - I think that the relevancy of the charts should be consistent with the relevancy of the various music consumption platforms, and whether or not you like the fact that streaming is now more widely used than sales, it still remains a fact. I actually find it extremely ironic how you're using the "general public" argument, when the reality is that the general public is now listening to music through streaming, while only dedicated fans are purchasing music anymore.

 

And of course it matters how many times a person plays a song because that speaks to the longevity of the song  If 1,000,000 people listen to a song in its first week and also its tenth week, while a different song has 1,000,000 people listening to it in its first week but only 100,000 listening to it in its tenth week, why should those two songs be considered equal in terms of popularity in the tenth week? The first song is clearly more popular than the second song in their respective tenth weeks. If the chart was sales-only, then you'd only be judging popularity in terms of how many NEW people discover the song and completely ignoring people who have already discovered the song but are still listening to it. Before streaming, that was the best we could do, but now that we have a way of measuring people who are discovering the song AND people who are still playing a song, that's obviously the far more accurate way of assessing the popularity of a song, and in all honesty I'm confused how anyone could not understand that.

[Destroun]

On 03/02/2017 at 5:13 PM, roman19911 said:

LOTB up to #6 on Pandora  

 

Can't wait for updated predictions

+

[Frozen99]

so happy for Alessia, go girl  

[Torturo]

23 hours ago, Rentboy said:

I don't see how one person streaming a song multiple times should be counted in compiling the charts data AT ALL. That just means ONE person really likes the song. When you purchase a song or album it counts just once so why should one persons individual streams count multiple times? This is what Im saying about how sales are the purest & most honest measure of popularity. Sure people can buy it numerous times but thats gonna cost them. Streaming over & over doesnt.

that's why 150 streams equals to one sale

[Fa1x intelectual]

I love this section so much!
Hoping Down smashes and Closer stays 28 weeks in the top 10. I've been predicting it would for so long! It Is so freaking close(r)! 

Edited February 5, 2017 by Fa1x intelectual

[Mr. Adele]

Hey charts goddesses, is there any chance of Scars To Your Beautiful go TOP 5 with the recent promo? (Tonight Show and Saturday Night Live)

Also late congrats to future Queen of Pop Alessia for her second TOP 10. 

[Émotif Fool]

If the gains are consistent, how long before IFIC snatches the top ten? 

[TayRianaPH]

Will any of these 3 singles reach the top 10/40 in the long run?

-I Got You by Bebe Rexha

-Words by Daya

-Issues by Julia Michaels

 

P.S. This thread has been my most visited one, back to when I was just a guest.

[Wonderland]

^ I see Issues going top 40 easily. I reckon top 10.

[alexanderao]

9 minutes ago, TayRianaPH said:

Will any of these 3 singles reach the top 10/40 in the long run?

-I Got You by Bebe Rexha

-Words by Daya

-Issues by Julia Michaels

 

P.S. This thread has been my most visited one, back to when I was just a guest.

I'd give Words a 1-5% chance. It's not even in the Spotify T200, and on top of that it has received a really lackluster response from pop radio, which she absolutely needs (and has needed) to get any of her songs in the Hot 100 top 40. I Got You is also doing poorly on streaming. 

 

Issues should definitely go top 40, as it's showing big growth potential on all metrics. I wouldn't rule out top 10 for it.

 

But all of the songs you mentioned only fit one format– pop. That, plus the fact that the first two are really struggling on streaming, will keep them out of the top 40. 

 

 

 

[alexanderao]

11 minutes ago, DangerousSwiftie said:

Well Issues could do well on HAC, and I could see I Got You doing a bit on Rhythmic, but I see your point. 

Yeah Issues will probably go top 20 on HAC if it goes top 10 on pop, which it is looking to do.

[alexanderao]

7 minutes ago, ChartsFan said:

One thing I like about sales is that over the life of a song, you can see its rise and fall in popularity.  Was the song just a big seller in the first week or two because of hype, or did sales build as the song became more popular with the general public.

No. You can see the number of people discovering it and liking it enough to buy it rise and fall. That ≠ popularity, though.

[brianc33710]

16 minutes ago, alexanderao said:

No. You can see the number of people discovering it and liking it enough to buy it rise and fall. That ≠ popularity, though.

Actually, you can judge the popularity of a song on ITunes. For example, a song that either quickly climbs or even debuts at the top of ITunes, but then falls rather rapidly, obviously aren't as popular with a significant proportion of music fans. However, songs like Can't Stop The Feeling and Closer (and to some extent, Don't Let Me Down) have shown sustained sales longevity, indicating they are still quite popular overall, and are still in the Top 25 and Top 5 respectively on the Hot 100 after nine months and six months on the chart (also respectively). Big sales also helped Love Yourself maintain high levels of airplay for a longer period of time. Furthermore, the sustained sales of Feeling and Closer have encouraged radio to keep playing both songs for long periods of time.  

[alexanderao]

Just now, ChartsFan said:

 

I sort of see your point. But one of the cornerstones of popularity by definition of the word is support, and buying a song is definitely support.

 

also along your point is that therefore consumption is not equal to popularity. A heavily memes song is not necessarily popular but watched for the action and not the song,  I only make this point as many people here use the two terms interchangeable and while they mostly are, they aren't always. I like how BB in the weekly album and hot 100 column clearly states they are consumption charts.

Uh... no?

 

Here's how Billboard defines the Hot 100. It's on the chart's page:

 

Quote

This week's most popular songs across all genres, ranked by radio airplay audience impressions as measured by Nielsen Music, sales data as compiled by Nielsen Music and streaming activity data provided by online music sources.

So yes, they do equate consumption with popularity at BB. 

 

Playing a song that you bought and playing that song on a streaming service are both consumption. You may think that buying a song shows a greater level of support for an artist, but that's not what matters for the Hot 100. 

 

[brianc33710]

5 minutes ago, alexanderao said:

So yes, they do equate consumption with popularity at BB. 

 

Playing a song that you bought and playing that song on a streaming service are both consumption. You may think that buying a song shows a greater level of support for an artist, but that's not what matters for the Hot 100. 

 

However, BB still realizes the purchase of the song, which requires $1.29, takes more money and effort than simply streaming the song. That's why BB continues to keep sales as a significant component of the Hot 100. Also, this is why sales are still weighted much higher per unit than streams of a song. Are sales where they were 3-5 years ago? No, but they still actively reflect the popularity of given songs.

[alexanderao]

1 minute ago, brianc33616 said:

Actually, you can judge the popularity of a song on ITunes. For example, a song that either quickly climbs or even debuts at the top of ITunes, but then falls rather rapidly, obviously aren't as popular with a significant proportion of music fans. However, songs like Can't Stop The Feeling and Closer (and to some extent, Don't Let Me Down) have shown sustained sales longevity, indicating they are still quite popular overall, and are still in the Top 25 and Top 5 respectively on the Hot 100 after nine months and six months on the chart (also respectively). Big sales also helped Love Yourself maintain high levels of airplay for a longer period of time. Furthermore, the sustained sales of Feeling and Closer have encouraged radio to keep playing both songs for long periods of time.  

Well, radio is encouraged by longevity on sales because what that means is that many people still just discovering a song, so they have reason to think that there's still an audience that wants to hear it (and not just an audience tired of hearing it). 

 

What I think the sales longevity of those songs really attests to is the massive exposure that they have had. High sales are buoyed by hype, name recognition, and a large fanbase initially, but the reason that songs have sales longevity is because of exposure, not necessarily popularity. You don't know how many of Closer or CSTF!'s buyers are still listening to the song. 

 

1 minute ago, brianc33616 said:

However, BB still realizes the purchase of the song, which requires $1.29, takes more money and effort than simply streaming the song. That's why BB continues to keep sales as a significant component of the Hot 100. Are sales where they were 3-5 years ago? No, but they still actively reflect the popularity of given songs.

I realize that too. But the amount of effort it takes to buy a song doesn't matter when we're talking about consumption. Like I said, if someone listens to a song, they are consuming it. It doesn't matter how they're listening to it– whether it be through FM radio or their iPod or their Spotify client. 

[brianc33710]

2 minutes ago, alexanderao said:

Well, radio is encouraged by longevity on sales because what that means is that many people still just discovering a song, so they have reason to think that there's still an audience that wants to hear it (and not just an audience tired of hearing it). 

 

What I think the sales longevity of those songs really attests to is the massive exposure that they have had. High sales are buoyed by hype, name recognition, and a large fanbase initially, but the reason that songs have sales longevity is because of exposure, not necessarily popularity. You don't know how many of Closer or CSTF!'s buyers are still listening to the song. 

 

I realize that too. But the amount of effort it takes to buy a song doesn't matter when we're talking about consumption. Like I said, if someone listens to a song, they are consuming it. It doesn't matter how they're listening to it– whether it be through FM radio or their iPod or their Spotify client. 

Well Closer is still streaming very well too, so plenty of people are listening to the song through that method as well.  Obviously, Feeling has a fan base, or else it wouldn't still be in the Top 30 (right now, it's fallen as low as 35 at times) after nine months, and Closer within the Top 20 (right now, it had fallen to 23 briefly), after six months. Even though Feeling's streaming was rather weak compared to its sales, the song is obviously popular with a large proportion of US music consumers.

 

Two even longer running songs are in the ITunes Top 100 right now. The Sound Of Silence was released in December 2015, and is still selling enough to stay on the charts. It's had video views too, and some Spotify streaming, but mainstream radio is too afraid of Rock music. However, TSOS continues to be a "buzz song," as no other song 14 months old still spends more time on the sales chart than out. Should it win its Grammy, maybe it'll get an even bigger boost.

 

Even longer ago than TSOS, Uptown Funk was released in November 2014, and still sporadically shows up in the ITunes Top 100 (it's 99 as of when I write this). It's video is still in the Top 20 in the US, it still reenters the Spotify Top 200 US from time to time (I don't think UF ever left WW Spotify). Unfortunately, because UF was reclassified to Gold by MB on Top 40 radio, we can't get the true number of impressions it gets each week. When we get an official MB AI leak that does include Gold airplay, we see UF still ranks within the Top 100. 

[Isaiah]

praying for alessia to rise a bit

 

but more importantly praying for love on the brain to finally reach top 10 in the coming weeks. 

 

 

ha best song deserves it 

[TayRianaPH]

Thanks for the response. 

 

Another question:

Which of these songs have the greatest potential to be a future #1 hit?

-Water Under The Bridge

-Love On The Brain

-I Feel It Coming

-That's What I Like

[alexanderao]

4 minutes ago, TayRianaPH said:

Thanks for the response. 

 

Another question:

Which of these songs have the greatest potential to be a future #1 hit?

-Water Under The Bridge

-Love On The Brain

-I Feel It Coming

-That's What I Like

I would say IFIC, but none of those are future #1s in my book. 

[TayRianaPH]

16 hours ago, alexanderao said:

I would say IFIC, but none of those are future #1s in my book. 

Owww. So basically, the foreseeable next #1 may either be some dark horse singles around, an upcoming viral meme, or an unreleased song.